| Analyzing The Only Suspect and Family - Goto page Previous 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 Next |
| View previous topic
:: View next topic |
wildroses
 Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:43 am |
|
|
|
Sociopath or not, she apparently knows the difference between right and wrong, so I don't think she qualifies for insanity, in the legal sense.
|
|
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 5940
Location: Not WildFlowers, Not wildcat
|
|
|
 |
 |
 |
|
| SavannahStar
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:43 am |
|
|
|
| Noor wrote: |
I don't think so, being a sociopathic liar is not a mental disorder, for example look where Scot Peterson is at right now. |
And we don't know if either of them had a bona fide diagnosis of sociopathy. Only what we've heard on TV. 
But....you are correct, being a sociopath is not a get out of jail free card.
|
|
**SuperStar**
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 21291
Location: Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Siddalee
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:45 am |
|
|
|
| minitess wrote: | I sure hope not, Sid.
I don't know what Florida laws are regarding a mental defect defense (insanity) and I don't know if being diagnosed as a sociopath would qualify a person for such a defense.  |
I don't know anything about that law either, but I've read that at least 20% of prison populations are sociopaths.
|
|
Ya-Ya!
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 6208
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| minitess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:45 am |
|
|
|
Noor - I guess it was reading some of those things OG posted that got me questioning that. Some theorize that the brain of a sociopath is actually physically different from a regular brain.
Also some theorize on a chemical imbalance causing the sociopathy.
Either of those would qualify (I would think) as a mental disorder.
But, wr you are correct in that she seemingly knows right from wrong, and she also knows what she did was wrong - and took steps to cover up her crime.
So in that regard - I would think she could never, ever pull off a mental defect defense.
I hope.
|
|
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 2213
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Noor
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:51 am |
|
|
|
I agree she won't be able to claim having a mental disorder.
I do believe she's a pathological liar.
|
|
Marco
Joined: 02 Jun 2006
Posts: 5201
Location: Ohio
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| wildroses
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:57 am |
|
|
|
| Noor wrote: | I agree she won't be able to claim having a mental disorder.
I do believe she's a pathological liar. |
I wonder if she was a liar, like she is today, when she was in high school.
From what we've seen and read, apparenty she has been living her entire adult life as a lie.
|
|
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 5940
Location: Not WildFlowers, Not wildcat
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Pragmatist
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:02 am |
|
|
|
Being a sociopath won't keep you out of jail. They still know the difference between right and wrong, they just don't care.
I'm not sure what all mental illnesses will keep you out of jail. I'd be interested to know.
The only thing I can think of is one where you don't know the difference between right and wrong and that can include temporary insanity I think.
I think as long as Prosecuters and prove Mensea the person goes to jail if found guilty.
Mensrea......Today most crimes, including common-law crimes, are defined by statutes that usually contain a word or phrase indicating the mensrea requirement. A typical statute, for example, may require that a person act knowingly, purposely, or recklessly.
Looks like Casey had Mensrea! (sounds like an intestinal disorder, doesn't it? )
|
|
Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 1849
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Obscuregawdess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:16 pm |
|
|
|
| minitess wrote: | OK here's a question. If Casey is diagnosed as a sociopath - is that a valid mental defect defense?
Could the bitch wind up in a mental institution instead of prison and the possible death penalty?  |
Nope. Many serial killers and hard-core criminals are sociopaths and NOT legally insane or psychotic to a point of legal insanity. You probably encounter sociopaths on a regular basis who have a conscience but not normal emotions or empathy, and they disguise it. In other words, a sociopath has the choice to act out in this way or not-- just like Christians have the choice to go to church or not. I mean, she knows the difference between right and wrong. Most sociopaths do, meaning they're not "hopelessly" nuts, just nuts in the way that they can justify their bad actions in such absurd ways to the average joe. She should still go down and, IMO, she will!
|
|
"Bratty Mama Leci"
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 12374
Location: Kentucky
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Obscuregawdess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:19 pm |
|
|
|
| Noor wrote: |
I don't think so, being a sociopathic liar is not a mental disorder, for example look where Scot Peterson is at right now. |
Exactly!!!!! 
|
|
"Bratty Mama Leci"
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 12374
Location: Kentucky
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Hannie
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:23 pm |
|
|
|
I think it's just a character flaw. Casey isn't insane, now way they can use that as a possible defense....
|
|
li'l Shango's Mommy
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 23202
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Isanah
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:23 pm |
|
|
|
| minitess wrote: | Noor - I guess it was reading some of those things OG posted that got me questioning that. Some theorize that the brain of a sociopath is actually physically different from a regular brain.
Also some theorize on a chemical imbalance causing the sociopathy.
Either of those would qualify (I would think) as a mental disorder.
But, wr you are correct in that she seemingly knows right from wrong, and she also knows what she did was wrong - and took steps to cover up her crime.
So in that regard - I would think she could never, ever pull off a mental defect defense.
I hope. |
We would have to build a lot of mental hospitals to house all the convicted sociopaths! They might as well make all prisons a mental hospital!
|
|
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 8047
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Obscuregawdess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:25 pm |
|
|
|
What does not guilty by reason of insanity mean?
Mental illness at the time of the offense is a prerequisite for a not-guilty-by-reason-of-insanity ruling, but legal insanity is not simply a judgment of whether or not a person has a mental illness. The law varies from state to state, but in most courts that recognize the "insanity defense," someone is found to be legally insane if he or she meets one of three conditions:
-Because of a mental disorder, the defendant did not understand that what he or she was doing was illegal.
-Because of a mental disorder, the defendant did not know what he or she was doing.
-Because of a mental disorder, the defendant was compelled to commit the crime by an irresistible force.
Mental illness can alter a person's conception of reality so that he or she does not realize the criminal nature of his or her actions or has no choice but to commit the crime. When this is the case, certain courts believe the person lacks this element of intention necessary for criminal guilt.
To prove legal insanity, the defense must provide credible expert testimony that says how the defendant is (or was) mentally ill, and then explain why this sort of mental illness means that the defendant did not intend to commit a crime. The jury does not decide whether the defendant is mentally ill; it determines whether or not the defense's expert testimony has demonstrated this fact, and then decides whether or not this mental disorder meant that he or she did not intend to commit a crime. Mental illness alone is no defense -- A person who suffers from deep psychosis will still be considered guilty if he or she commits a crime intentionally.
http://people.howstuffworks.com/question509.htm
|
|
"Bratty Mama Leci"
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 12374
Location: Kentucky
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Obscuregawdess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:33 pm |
|
|
|
Antisocial Personality Disorder is also known as psychopathy or sociopathy. Individuals with this disorder have little regard for the feeling and welfare of others. As a clinical diagnosis it is usually limited to those over age 18. It can be diagnosed in younger people if the they commit isolated antisocial acts and do not show signs of another mental disorder.
Antisocial Personality Disorder is chronic, beginning in adolescence and continuing throughout adulthood. There are ten general symptoms:
-not learning from experience
-no sense of responsibility
-inability to form meaningful relationships
-inability to control impulses
-lack of moral sense
-chronically antisocial behavior
-no change in behavior after punishment
-emotional immaturity
-lack of guilt
-self-centeredness
People with this disorder may exhibit criminal behavior. They may not work. If they do work, they are frequently absent or may quit suddenly. They do not consider other people's wishes, welfare or rights. They can be manipulative and may lie to gain personal pleasure or profit. They may default on loans, fail to provide child support, or fail to care for their dependents adequately.
High risk sexual behavior and substance abuse are common. Impulsiveness, failure to plan ahead, aggressiveness, irritability, irresponsibility, and a reckless disregard for their own safety and the safety of others are traits of the antisocial personality.
Socioeconomic status, gender, and genetic factors play a role. Males are more likely to be antisocial than females. Those from lower socioeconomic groups are more susceptible. A family history of the disorder puts one at higher risk.
There are many theories about the cause of Antisocial Personality Disorder including experiencing neglectful parenting as a child, low levels of certain neurotransmitters in the brain, and belief that antisocial behavior is justified because of difficult circumstances. Psychotherapy, group therapy, and family therapy are common treatments. The effects of medical treatment are inconclusive. Unfortunately, most people with Antisocial Personality Disorder reject treatment. Therefore, recovery rates are low.
http://rexcurry.net/mental-illness-psychopaths-sociopaths-socialists-insanity.html
-------------------------------------------
In other words, sociopaths and psychopaths are not legally insane, not in the least.
|
|
"Bratty Mama Leci"
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 12374
Location: Kentucky
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| prolific
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:38 pm |
|
|
|
| wildroses wrote: | | Sociopath or not, she apparently knows the difference between right and wrong, so I don't think she qualifies for insanity, in the legal sense. |
I agree and I remember hearing a few people discussing the difference and they said just what you're saying, that in order to use the insanity defense the person would not have been able to distinguish between right and wrong.
So just the fact that Casey did whatever she did to Caylee then disposed of Caylee and lied to cover her tracks shows she knew right from wrong.
|
|
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 9562
Location: Living happily in my "clueless" little world.
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Obscuregawdess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:46 pm |
|
|
|
Yes, and usually premeditation shows a person had time to decide whether or not to do it. Only if someone was legally insane would they suffer from delusions and such or the most severe type of bipolar disorder accompanied by schizzophrenia or some other disorder would be in another reality to the point they were not functioning in society normally. Take Andrea Yates for example. She was literally "in another world" and in and out of sanity, very mentally disturbed and sick. Casey was manipulative and one of her goals and many sociopath's goals are to fit into society as someone "important" and using what they know and learn to achieve a certain status. They may be mentally ill to an extent that their priorities and goals are far more shallow and self-serving than the average person, but they are not legally insane and do know the difference between right and wrong and what is criminal and not criminal. Like someone said earlier, they know but just don't care. therefore, they are making a conscious choice to do what they want. They are held accountable when caught and just as guilty as a non-sociopath. No legal insanity going on there.
|
|
"Bratty Mama Leci"
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 12374
Location: Kentucky
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| minitess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 12:58 pm |
|
|
|
Thanks guys. I got a little nervous reading some of that stuff on sociopathy.
I feel better about it now!
|
|
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 2213
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Hannie
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 1:36 pm |
|
|
|
Those posts are too long for me to even comprehend, so I'll take your word for it! 
|
|
li'l Shango's Mommy
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 23202
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Obscuregawdess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 3:19 pm |
|
|
|
Hannie  , I got ya!
No problem, minitess. In laymen's terms they are insane, but legally they aren't. Sociopathy isn't a delusional disorder or mental handicap, just an illness or disorder that is of a physical sense but does not control their actions. They can control their own actions.  IMO, Casey could control hers very easily but, as she has displayed, she doesn't give a fuck unless it's in her best interest.
Last edited by Obscuregawdess on Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
|
|
"Bratty Mama Leci"
Joined: 02 Aug 2006
Posts: 12374
Location: Kentucky
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| minitess
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 3:22 pm |
|
|
|
Thanks for the laymen's terms explanation - now it all makes perfect sense to me!
|
|
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 2213
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Isanah
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:34 pm |
|
|
|
| prolific wrote: |
I agree and I remember hearing a few people discussing the difference and they said just what you're saying, that in order to use the insanity defense the person would not have been able to distinguish between right and wrong.
So just the fact that Casey did whatever she did to Caylee then disposed of Caylee and lied to cover her tracks shows she knew right from wrong. |
Then we have Lee quoting her as saying she was "a bad mother, daughter"..and whatever!
|
|
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 8047
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Isanah
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:35 pm |
|
|
|
| Hannie wrote: | | Those posts are too long for me to even comprehend, so I'll take your word for it! |
OG is doing a thesis! 
|
|
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 8047
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Hannie
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:41 pm |
|
|
|
| Isanah wrote: |
OG is doing a thesis! |
I have no idea what she's doing, but it made my head spin 360 degrees, For a moment it felt like I was 'Carrie'....
|
|
li'l Shango's Mommy
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 23202
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Isanah
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:44 pm |
|
|
|
| Hannie wrote: |
I have no idea what she's doing, but it made my head spin 360 degrees, For a moment it felt like I was 'Carrie'.... |
I've read a lot of what she has posted, and I'm like I have a few of those characteristics! It's a good thing I don't have the majority of them!
|
|
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 8047
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Heli
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:46 pm |
|
|
|
| Hannie wrote: |
I have no idea what she's doing, but it made my head spin 360 degrees, For a moment it felt like I was 'Carrie'.... |
Nothing an Exorcist couldn't remedy, Hannie
|
|
Transcription Goddess
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 23516
Location: Puffed Up DimWit
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
| Hannie
Posted:
Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:48 pm |
|
|
|
I have difficulties reading long posts sometimes, so it's just me..
|
|
li'l Shango's Mommy
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 23202
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
