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Hannie
 Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:33 pm |
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Yes for sure a nice compliment, but also very true, IMO, 
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li'l Shango's Mommy
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 29039
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
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| apodixis
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:37 pm |
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Shillary - 
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Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 5147
Location: State of Jefferson, Ecotopia
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| Hannie
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:39 pm |
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| apodixis wrote: | | Shillary - |
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li'l Shango's Mommy
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 29039
Location: The Hague, The Netherlands
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| tulsad
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:48 pm |
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| apodixis wrote: | About the website which is the topic of this thread : http://member.telpacific.com.au/rolyroper/NataleeHolloway/index.htm
Pages 11 and 11a of the website rate links into five categories: Pro-Holloway, Natalee “hater”, Rational-neutral, Crackpot, and Flying Turd Awards.
Refugees Unleashed is ranked as Rational-neutral and characterized as “A wide range of viewpoints represented”. And “characterised by HMI supporters as a Natalee-hater site for its diversity of views and tolerance of posters with HMI views”.
Nice compliment, Eh ? |
It's Saturday and I may be reading with my eyes shut, but isn't "hater" and "tolerance" in the description of the same entity an oxymoron? 
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Sparkly Tree
Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 10338
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| WordsofWisdom
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:53 pm |
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| HannieC wrote: | | apodixis wrote: | | Shillary - |
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Oh Hannie!
That is my most favorite!!!!!
I love it!
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Gone to the great place in the sky
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 12505
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| apodixis
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 6:55 pm |
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Tulsad, I think its a tongue in cheek conundrum.
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Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 5147
Location: State of Jefferson, Ecotopia
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| tulsad
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 7:05 pm |
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| apodixis wrote: | Tulsad, I think its a tongue in cheek conundrum.
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Ah, cripes, Apodixis - I hate conundrums! On the other hand, I can be quite tolerant of a joke.
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Sparkly Tree
Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 10338
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| spngbobthebldr
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 7:54 pm |
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| K_Meine wrote: | I just don't understand how a person can simply disappear like that with out foulplay being involved. If she were in the water, I would have thought they would have found her but you never know. I've had my suspicions of the boys all along, but even an accomplished criminal(s) would need more time than was shown to create the perfect crime scene that doesn't exist. It just doesn't seem feasible.
If NH was as drunk as speculated, she certainly wouldn't be able to hide herself and not be found. My guess is her remains are still somewhere on or in the island. Underground cavern, manhole, septic tank, etc.
Question: Was anyone searching for her between the morning she was reported missing and when the Twits arrived and what were the boys doing during that time? Joran was at schoool, yes? |
People fall off of boats and are never found. Peopl drown in rivers and are never found. Only one of three bodies was found when that woman threw her kids in the San Fran Bay.
No one knew she was missing in those hours so why would anyone be looking for her?. The chaperone didn't bother to tell the ALE that she was missing and her friends hopped on planes and hot footed it out of there.
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It ain't easy wearing square pants!
Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 2945
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| WordsofWisdom
Posted:
Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:40 pm |
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| spngbobthebldr wrote: | People fall off of boats and are never found. Peopl drown in rivers and are never found. Only one of three bodies was found when that woman threw her kids in the San Fran Bay.
No one knew she was missing in those hours so why would anyone be looking for her?. The chaperone didn't bother to tell the ALE that she was missing and her friends hopped on planes and hot footed it out of there. |
And Beth and the posse was too busy doing a "family investigation" to bother reporting her daughter missing. Shoot- Beth didn't even bother calling a hospital, a morgue, nothing... why is that, you suppose?
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Gone to the great place in the sky
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 12505
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| dugo
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:12 am |
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| apodixis wrote: | From page 8 of the website featured in this thread : “Comparing the frequency of beach accidents to rape, the odds favor accident, misadventure, over crime”
How do you rate the respective probabilities of accidental drowning, runaway or foul play ? |
LIes, damn lies or statistics.
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Dashing Dutch Dynamo Dude
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 6808
Location: verwegistan
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| yankee-in-france
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 8:07 am |
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| HannieC wrote: | | apodixis wrote: | | Shillary - |
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They get cuter and cuter -- Shillary is great. 
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YIF
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 10445
Location: France
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| apodixis
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 12:15 pm |
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One of the more interesting things about the website which is the topic of this thread ( http://member.telpacific.com.au/rolyroper/NataleeHolloway/index.htm ) is how the author approaches the case. In the introduction he says that he has “spent a lifetime solving the mysteries of industrial accidents and even the occasional sabotage. “
Excerpt from Chapter 3:
“Armchair Detective
We watch Law & Order, C.S.I, and sundry police reality re-creation shows. We know how it goes, particularly from the latter - evidence….
We know personal testimony and eye witnesses can be very unreliable, that fingerprints can be mis-matched or falsified, and that even DNA can fail through contamination. I have spent most of my life sorting fact from fiction in a non-criminal technical field and have learned the hard way that statements are the least reliable element in an investigation.
The test for any proposed scenario is that it first conforms to the known facts….Then it has to pass a credibility test of Ockham's Razor, the less complex answer is the more likely. (e.g. we can discount alien abduction)…”
In the NH case the simplest explanation is that she went swimming, drowned, and her body washed out to sea.
The foul play theory involves the complication of explaining how a body can be made to completely disappear in such a short time. Arranging for a boat for disposal, elaborate cover-up conspiracies, etc. - The more complicated the circumstances, the more likely that evidence of it will be revealed. Of course anything is possible.
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Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 5147
Location: State of Jefferson, Ecotopia
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| Heli
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 12:35 pm |
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The more complicated the circumstances, the more likely that evidence of it will be revealed.
I've always firmly believed this and rejected the intricate conspiracy
theories of half the island of Aruba being involved in a drugging,
gang rape, murder, secretion and disposal of Natalee Holloway. Not
to mention the coverup by the government, LE and justice system.
Deepak Kalpoe: "You'd be surprised how simple it was that night"
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Transcription Goddess
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 24627
Location: Puffed Up DimWit
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| WordsofWisdom
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 12:52 pm |
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| Heli wrote: | The more complicated the circumstances, the more likely that evidence of it will be revealed.
I've always firmly believed this and rejected the intricate conspiracy
theories of half the island of Aruba being involved in a drugging,
gang rape, murder, secretion and disposal of Natalee Holloway. Not
to mention the coverup by the government, LE and justice system.
Deepak Kalpoe: "You'd be surprised how simple it was that night" |
But Heli...
I believe that is exactly what is going on... just not in Aruba.
There are a lot of people and circumstances involved in the mis-information and coverup (HMI). And there are a lot of associated twists and turns because of it.
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Gone to the great place in the sky
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 12505
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| iwabwu
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 2:46 pm |
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| WordsofWisdom wrote: | | Heli wrote: | The more complicated the circumstances, the more likely that evidence of it will be revealed.
I've always firmly believed this and rejected the intricate conspiracy
theories of half the island of Aruba being involved in a drugging,
gang rape, murder, secretion and disposal of Natalee Holloway. Not
to mention the coverup by the government, LE and justice system.
Deepak Kalpoe: "You'd be surprised how simple it was that night" |
But Heli...
I believe that is exactly what is going on... just not in Aruba.
There are a lot of people and circumstances involved in the mis-information and coverup (HMI). And there are a lot of associated twists and turns because of it. |
Why does it have to involve half the island of Aruba? Was the van der Sloot compund fully searched? Was the stone and cement work done around the pool fully investigated? Who installed that patio?
From what I recall reading, it was installed within the days after Natalee's disappearance. It was installed just days before the limited search of Joran's living space. It could be as simple as Natalee being buried under the stone and cement. JMHO
Was ground penetrating radar used to rule out the patio? Who installed that patio? When? When was the order placed?
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** Banned **
Joined: 17 May 2006
Posts: 6314
Location: Third Rock From The Sun
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| yankee-in-france
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:19 pm |
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| iwabwu wrote: | | WordsofWisdom wrote: | | Heli wrote: | The more complicated the circumstances, the more likely that evidence of it will be revealed.
I've always firmly believed this and rejected the intricate conspiracy
theories of half the island of Aruba being involved in a drugging,
gang rape, murder, secretion and disposal of Natalee Holloway. Not
to mention the coverup by the government, LE and justice system.
Deepak Kalpoe: "You'd be surprised how simple it was that night" |
But Heli...
I believe that is exactly what is going on... just not in Aruba.
There are a lot of people and circumstances involved in the mis-information and coverup (HMI). And there are a lot of associated twists and turns because of it. |
Why does it have to involve half the island of Aruba? Was the van der Sloot compund fully searched? Was the stone and cement work done around the pool fully investigated? Who installed that patio?
From what I recall reading, it was installed within the days after Natalee's disappearance. It was installed just days before the limited search of Joran's living space. It could be as simple as Natalee being buried under the stone and cement. JMHO
Was ground penetrating radar used to rule out the patio? Who installed that patio? When? When was the order placed? |
Wabbi, if you have evidence that Natalee is buried under the patio, you should immediately contact ALE? If you have no such evidence, then what is the point of this question? I usually have patience with you, but you are inferring something here that is totally off-the-wall.
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YIF
Joined: 30 Mar 2006
Posts: 10445
Location: France
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| apodixis
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:28 pm |
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You are asking interesting questions as usual, Wabbi. And that is a nice avatar.
“Who installed that patio? …. From what I recall reading, it was installed within the days after Natalee's disappearance. It was installed just days before the limited search of Joran's living space. It could be as simple as Natalee being buried under the stone and cement. JMHO”
But every additional twist in a theory is another source for evidence to be revealed. And if that evidence does not come forward, that is a possible indication that the theory may not be correct.
So in the NH case whoever did the installation should be available to provide evidence one way or the other. Of course anything is possible, and Jimmy Hoffa’s body still has not been found.
Last edited by apodixis on Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:30 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 5147
Location: State of Jefferson, Ecotopia
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| Heli
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:29 pm |
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The inference was ok 18 months ago, but to have it vomitted
back at us over and over and over over and over again, hundreds
of times as though magically there's going to be an answer.
Nobody likes a friggin NAG!!
And what's happened to that ignore button plzzzz I'm beggin
the person who's working on that
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Transcription Goddess
Joined: 23 Mar 2006
Posts: 24627
Location: Puffed Up DimWit
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| tulsad
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:41 pm |
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Wabbi - you might want to track down Granny Toad; she has the same questions you do - the two of you may be able to answer them. Or, as YIF said, if you believe so strongly that this should be investigated more thoroughly, maybe you should contact Aruban LE? It would be much more productive than simply repeating your questions.
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Sparkly Tree
Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 10338
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| iwabwu
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 4:32 pm |
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| tulsad wrote: | | Wabbi - you might want to track down Granny Toad; she has the same questions you do - the two of you may be able to answer them. Or, as YIF said, if you believe so strongly that this should be investigated more thoroughly, maybe you should contact Aruban LE? It would be much more productive than simply repeating your questions. |
Does GrannyToad ask many questions? She usually supplies answers, from what I recall.
I believe ALE knows all about that patio. Wasn't anyone curious at the time? Why wasn't the entire van der Sloot property searched? Why was the search limited?
Why not eliminate the patio as a burial/dumping place?
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** Banned **
Joined: 17 May 2006
Posts: 6314
Location: Third Rock From The Sun
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| tulsad
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 4:39 pm |
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| iwabwu wrote: | | tulsad wrote: | | Wabbi - you might want to track down Granny Toad; she has the answers to your questions(replaces: same questions you do - the two of you may be able to answer them). Or, as YIF said, if you believe so strongly that this should be investigated more thoroughly, maybe you should contact Aruban LE? It would be much more productive than simply repeating your questions. |
Does GrannyToad ask many questions? She usually supplies answers, from what I recall. SEE ABOVE - you are correct, Wabbi
I believe ALE knows all about that patio. Wasn't anyone curious at the time? Why wasn't the entire van der Sloot property searched? Why was the search limited?
Why not eliminate the patio as a burial/dumping place? |
I believe you should speak to ALE regarding your questions about the patio and the van der Sloot property; they can answer them - they did the searches. Any response you get here is merely speculation and a waste of your time.
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Sparkly Tree
Joined: 19 Aug 2006
Posts: 10338
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| apodixis
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 5:36 pm |
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The author of the website being discussed in this thread, http://member.telpacific.com.au/rolyroper/NataleeHolloway/index.htm , has now added a page 14, specifically addressing Wabbi’s question above “Do you see a reference link or source for the 'odds' - I did not see one” which was in response to mine -. “How do you rate the respective probabilities of accidental drowning, runaway or foul play ?"
It is very interesting reading.
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Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 5147
Location: State of Jefferson, Ecotopia
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| iwabwu
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 5:48 pm |
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| apodixis wrote: | The author of the website being discussed in this thread, http://member.telpacific.com.au/rolyroper/NataleeHolloway/index.htm , has now added a page 14, specifically addressing Wabbi’s question above “Do you see a reference link or source for the 'odds' - I did not see one” which was in response to mine -. “How do you rate the respective probabilities of accidental drowning, runaway or foul play ?"
It is very interesting reading. |
Since Natalee was an adult, whe did not runaway, she could have walked away at any time. MO
How does an island repond to a potential drowning? Wait 48 hours? Blame insurance fraud? Blame the victim?
How does an island respond to potential foul play? Accept lies from witnesses/suspects as gospel?
Why wouldn't someone want to look at all information available? Not just rely on the conclusions of others?
Turn off the kool-aid tapper if you will. Why wouldn't ALE consider that patio? Didn't someone look and wonder when the property was under watch in the early days of the investigation?
If someone wants to find answers, I believe they need to ask questions. I believe KJ, asked for a search of the entire van der Sloot compound. The search was limited on-site. That just doesn't make good sense to me. JMHO
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** Banned **
Joined: 17 May 2006
Posts: 6314
Location: Third Rock From The Sun
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| Abarth
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:03 pm |
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| iwabwu wrote: | | apodixis wrote: | The author of the website being discussed in this thread, http://member.telpacific.com.au/rolyroper/NataleeHolloway/index.htm , has now added a page 14, specifically addressing Wabbi’s question above “Do you see a reference link or source for the 'odds' - I did not see one” which was in response to mine -. “How do you rate the respective probabilities of accidental drowning, runaway or foul play ?"
It is very interesting reading. |
Since Natalee was an adult, whe did not runaway, she could have walked away at any time. MO
How does an island repond to a potential drowning? Wait 48 hours? Blame insurance fraud? Blame the victim?
How does an island respond to potential foul play? Accept lies from witnesses/suspects as gospel?
Why wouldn't someone want to look at all information available? Not just rely on the conclusions of others?
Turn off the kool-aid tapper if you will. Why wouldn't ALE consider that patio? Didn't someone look and wonder when the property was under watch in the early days of the investigation?
If someone wants to find answers, I believe they need to ask questions. I believe KJ, asked for a search of the entire van der Sloot compound. The search was limited on-site. That just doesn't make good sense to me. JMHO |
What do the BFF of the missing person ? Take the first plane out of the island ? Get the hell out of there ?
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Joined: 24 Mar 2006
Posts: 1690
Location: Utreg
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| iwabwu
Posted:
Sun Feb 11, 2007 6:09 pm |
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| Abarth wrote: | | iwabwu wrote: |
Since Natalee was an adult, whe did not runaway, she could have walked away at any time. MO
How does an island repond to a potential drowning? Wait 48 hours? Blame insurance fraud? Blame the victim?
How does an island respond to potential foul play? Accept lies from witnesses/suspects as gospel?
Why wouldn't someone want to look at all information available? Not just rely on the conclusions of others?
Turn off the kool-aid tapper if you will. Why wouldn't ALE consider that patio? Didn't someone look and wonder when the property was under watch in the early days of the investigation?
If someone wants to find answers, I believe they need to ask questions. I believe KJ, asked for a search of the entire van der Sloot compound. The search was limited on-site. That just doesn't make good sense to me. JMHO |
What do the BFF of the missing person ? Take the first plane out of the island ? Get the hell out of there ? |
I'm not sure what the BFF are. However -
Many have left the island or their government positions as this case has evolved. The ones remaining are the van der Sloots and Kalpoes.
I have expectations that the Dutch are still reviewing and working this case. Perhaps they along with Peter DeVries will find evidence of a cover-up, conflict of interest, collusion, nepotism, cronyism, etc.
Is the investigation concluded? What are the conclusions released? Have they turned over the case file to the family of Natalee Holloway?
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** Banned **
Joined: 17 May 2006
Posts: 6314
Location: Third Rock From The Sun
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