So it was Beth Twitty

Moderator: Fashionista

Postby luvslalom » Wed Jul 29, 2009 7:47 am

iquitos wrote:
luvslalom wrote:
http://tiny.cc/UAYPC

Early conversations in this url. They had their agents everywhere.


which part? i loved this:

SARAH OVERSTREET »

Graduation does not suddenly make a teenager into an adult

I wish I could be more charitable about the seven adults who "chaperoned" 124 Alabama high school seniors to a trip to the exotic Caribbean island of Aruba.
Natalee Holloway's relatives must be a lot more forgiving than I would be. Marcia Twitty, the aunt of the honor society, full scholarship-winning recent high school graduate, says Holloway's family doesn't blame the chaperones. She told reporters the adults who accompanied the graduates on their senior trip were "incredible, wonderful people. ... These were people who knew our kids day in and day out," according to a quote on wnbc.com.

Incredible, wonderful people who had a severe lapse in judgment, that is. "Let's see, I think it might be fun to be outnumbered over 17 to one by teenagers hell-bent on getting away from their folks on an island where they can drink unlimited amounts of alcohol like they can't back in the States. And keep track of them? Well, we'll be around, somewhere, if they need us. ... "

From news reports, the recent Mountain Brook High School graduates from Birmingham, Ala., pretty much ran over the island like a bunch of ants at a Sunday school picnic, with too many treats to even take in all at once.

A woman named Jodi Bearman put the trip together, and defended the chaperones. "They (the students) sign a waiver, and it basically makes sure it's clear to them that they are responsible for themselves," she told wnbc. "Chaperones assist in emergencies, but by no means are liable if an accident should happen or anything like that."

Obviously not, since they left without the teen when she didn't show up at the airport the next morning. Can you even imagine leaving a foreign country while one of the children you came with is missing?

After absolving the chaperones, Bearman rearranged her mouth so she could talk out the other side: "Although the students are expected to be responsible for themselves, Bearman said she knew that this being their first venture out after high school, chaperones would be needed to supervise," wnbc reports. Letting kids run around an island bar-hopping is supervising?

"The chaperones intentionally go out at night, and try to go to the places and check on the kids, but by no means are there specific instructions to do so," Bearman said. Oh? Why not? Because the kids are suddenly all grown up because they got to put their tassels on the other side of their mortarboards?

That brings us to the students' parents. Did they honestly think it was a good idea to send kids on a trip where their children sign waivers relieving the adults with them of any responsibility to keep them as safe as possible?

I know from bitter experience what can happen by overestimating a child's maturity and likelihood to do what I say, and how powerful peer influence is on a child's behavior. When I had an almost-17-year-old foster daughter, I once put too much trust in her and gave her and her sweet girlfriend, their lovely batting eyes assuring me how they would comport themselves, just enough extra freedom to let them seriously endanger themselves.

Am I nuts, or is it the parents who let young kids sign their safety away?


I don't know which is better...to be filthy rich or just plain filthy. The idesgressions of the upper upper class...have fun but don't get caught.
User avatar
luvslalom
**Deactivated**
 
Posts: 4883
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:22 am

Postby petals » Wed Jul 29, 2009 7:49 am

luvslalom wrote:
http://tiny.cc/UAYPC

Early conversations in this url. They had their agents everywhere.

What is this link supposed to be showing us? All it does is link us to a conversation between posters on scrux that took place in February 2006. Where are the "early conversations" that show "agents" and who were these "agents" working for?
petals
 
Posts: 837
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:04 am

Postby luvslalom » Wed Jul 29, 2009 7:54 am

petals wrote:What is this link supposed to be showing us? All it does is link us to a conversation between posters on scrux that took place in February 2006. Where are the "early conversations" that show "agents" and who were these "agents" working for?


Well I was wondering about the same thing. Actually I got that wrong..the word wasn't agent. The sleuth was looking for a Mastermind in MB. Apparently the MB advocate said there weren't any.
User avatar
luvslalom
**Deactivated**
 
Posts: 4883
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:22 am

Postby ghost » Wed Jul 29, 2009 9:52 am

luvslalom wrote:
I don't know which is better...to be filthy rich or just plain filthy. The idesgressions of the upper upper class...have fun but don't get caught.


:lol:

Yes the residents of Mountain Brook, ALABAMA are upper upper class.

That theory absolutely flies in the Northeast where some people truly do have enough money and strings to erase any mistake. I thought GossipGirl was fantasy until I met a few real Serena's and Blair's. Not quite the same in...let's be honest here...a nice little suburb in a very poor state.
User avatar
ghost
 
Posts: 2919
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2007 1:59 pm

Postby sarge » Wed Jul 29, 2009 12:21 pm

iquitos wrote:
luvslalom wrote:
http://tiny.cc/UAYPC

Early conversations in this url. They had their agents everywhere.


which part? i loved this:

SARAH OVERSTREET »

Graduation does not suddenly make a teenager into an adult

I wish I could be more charitable about the seven adults who "chaperoned" 124 Alabama high school seniors to a trip to the exotic Caribbean island of Aruba.
Natalee Holloway's relatives must be a lot more forgiving than I would be. Marcia Twitty, the aunt of the honor society, full scholarship-winning recent high school graduate, says Holloway's family doesn't blame the chaperones. She told reporters the adults who accompanied the graduates on their senior trip were "incredible, wonderful people. ... These were people who knew our kids day in and day out," according to a quote on wnbc.com.

Incredible, wonderful people who had a severe lapse in judgment, that is. "Let's see, I think it might be fun to be outnumbered over 17 to one by teenagers hell-bent on getting away from their folks on an island where they can drink unlimited amounts of alcohol like they can't back in the States. And keep track of them? Well, we'll be around, somewhere, if they need us. ... "

From news reports, the recent Mountain Brook High School graduates from Birmingham, Ala., pretty much ran over the island like a bunch of ants at a Sunday school picnic, with too many treats to even take in all at once.

A woman named Jodi Bearman put the trip together, and defended the chaperones. "They (the students) sign a waiver, and it basically makes sure it's clear to them that they are responsible for themselves," she told wnbc. "Chaperones assist in emergencies, but by no means are liable if an accident should happen or anything like that."

Obviously not, since they left without the teen when she didn't show up at the airport the next morning. Can you even imagine leaving a foreign country while one of the children you came with is missing?

After absolving the chaperones, Bearman rearranged her mouth so she could talk out the other side: "Although the students are expected to be responsible for themselves, Bearman said she knew that this being their first venture out after high school, chaperones would be needed to supervise," wnbc reports. Letting kids run around an island bar-hopping is supervising?

"The chaperones intentionally go out at night, and try to go to the places and check on the kids, but by no means are there specific instructions to do so," Bearman said. Oh? Why not? Because the kids are suddenly all grown up because they got to put their tassels on the other side of their mortarboards?

That brings us to the students' parents. Did they honestly think it was a good idea to send kids on a trip where their children sign waivers relieving the adults with them of any responsibility to keep them as safe as possible?

I know from bitter experience what can happen by overestimating a child's maturity and likelihood to do what I say, and how powerful peer influence is on a child's behavior. When I had an almost-17-year-old foster daughter, I once put too much trust in her and gave her and her sweet girlfriend, their lovely batting eyes assuring me how they would comport themselves, just enough extra freedom to let them seriously endanger themselves.

Am I nuts, or is it the parents who let young kids sign their safety away?




Did parents sign anything?
User avatar
sarge
 
Posts: 12737
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:31 am
Location: georgia

Postby luvslalom » Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:32 am

sarge wrote:


Did parents sign anything?


I think they did Sarge b/c even the 18 yo's weren't 'adult' according to Alabama 'of age status' standard.
I would never have okayed a trip like that for any of mine. Our grads have 'bush parties' with many supervising parents, visits by LE, and ambulance nearby, as well as being bussed to locations. The parents don't mix with the kids but are 'there' and supervising. Alcohol is supervised as well. Everything has to arrive sealed; if the seal is broken it doesn't go to the bush party. The kids still manage to enjoy themselves, and come home safely.
User avatar
luvslalom
**Deactivated**
 
Posts: 4883
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:22 am

Postby wanderer » Thu Jul 30, 2009 12:05 pm

luvslalom wrote:
I think they did Sarge b/c even the 18 yo's weren't 'adult' according to Alabama 'of age status' standard.
I would never have okayed a trip like that for any of mine. Our grads have 'bush parties' with many supervising parents, visits by LE, and ambulance nearby, as well as being bussed to locations. The parents don't mix with the kids but are 'there' and supervising. Alcohol is supervised as well. Everything has to arrive sealed; if the seal is broken it doesn't go to the bush party. The kids still manage to enjoy themselves, and come home safely.


When you refer to a bush party, is that a political rally ?
wanderer
** Banned **
 
Posts: 799
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 12:42 pm

Postby sarge » Thu Jul 30, 2009 1:42 pm

I would not pay for my daughter to go on a cruise trip to the Bahamas when she graduated in 1986 but she was 18 that week and I think legally she could have gone if she wanted to and if she had the money. Since she did not go I don't know whether parents signed anything but I think the kids signed the waivers that that was all. I had heard stories about how drunk the kids already were before they got on the ship. Some were sent back home before they boarded and one year a boy jumped off the ship while it was in port one yr and was not allowed to board by the cruiseline. The trip was not sponsored in any way by the school and had been an annual thing for years.
The ship stays overnight in Nassau and
I think Nassau is probably a lot more dangerous at night than Aruba.
It had never happened before or again in Aruba so it was probably a case of making the wrong decisions that last night to get intoxicated and then leave her group.
All the rest got home ok and apparently traveled back to the hotel as groups.

My daughter did go with a group of girls to Myrtle Beach that same year and rented an apt for a week.
User avatar
sarge
 
Posts: 12737
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:31 am
Location: georgia

Postby WordsofWisdom » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:33 pm

A woman named Jodi Bearman put the trip together, and defended the chaperones. "They (the students) sign a waiver, and it basically makes sure it's clear to them that they are responsible for themselves," she told wnbc. "Chaperones assist in emergencies, but by no means are liable if an accident should happen or anything like that."



If what Bearman says is true, that a document the students signed was to "makes sure it's clear to them that they are responsible for themselves," thats fine, but to call it a waiver is ridiculous. None of those students had a legal status to sign anything. They were all minors. Bearman knew that. So why would she call is a waiver?
"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
User avatar
WordsofWisdom
Gone to the great place in the sky
 
Posts: 12505
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:51 pm

Postby henk » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:45 pm

Sarge, I agree it's scary to let your 18 year old daughter go.. But what could happen in Barbados what could not happen in Myrtle Beach ? And I'm not talking about difficulties being in a different country..
henk
 
Posts: 1466
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2008 8:53 am
Location: nederland

Postby resigned » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:46 pm

WordsofWisdom wrote:
A woman named Jodi Bearman put the trip together, and defended the chaperones. "They (the students) sign a waiver, and it basically makes sure it's clear to them that they are responsible for themselves," she told wnbc. "Chaperones assist in emergencies, but by no means are liable if an accident should happen or anything like that."



If what Bearman says is true, that a document the students signed was to "makes sure it's clear to them that they are responsible for themselves," thats fine, but to call it a waiver is ridiculous. None of those students had a legal status to sign anything. They were all minors. Bearman knew that. So why would she call is a waiver?


Standard group travel document.
Image
User avatar
resigned
 
Posts: 44946
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 9:42 pm
Location: Peru

Postby resigned » Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:55 pm

henk wrote:Sarge, I agree it's scary to let your 18 year old daughter go.. But what could happen in Barbados what could not happen in Myrtle Beach ? And I'm not talking about difficulties being in a different country..

At least in Myrtle Beach things wouldn't be blamed on the translation problems after LE screws up the case initially because of their laissez-faire attitude. :lol:
Image
User avatar
resigned
 
Posts: 44946
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 9:42 pm
Location: Peru

Postby iquitos » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:00 pm

resigned wrote:
Standard group travel document.


legally not worth the paper is is xeroxed on.
Dante described vengeance as "love of justice perverted to revenge and spite".
User avatar
iquitos
 
Posts: 21252
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: in my mind's eye

Postby resigned » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:07 pm

iquitos wrote:
legally not worth the paper is is xeroxed on.




.....That may or may not be true, but a
"waiver" remains a standard group travel document. - just like those waivers that people sign when they go on a boating excursion while on Aruba. I hereby affirm and sign that if I should die on this trip that it is no one's fault but my own no matter who watches and does nothing.
Image
User avatar
resigned
 
Posts: 44946
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 9:42 pm
Location: Peru

Postby Black-Tulip » Thu Jul 30, 2009 4:43 pm

resigned wrote:


.....That may or may not be true, but a
"waiver" remains a standard group travel document. - just like those waivers that people sign when they go on a boating excursion while on Aruba. I hereby affirm and sign that if I should die on this trip that it is no one's fault but my own no matter who watches and does nothing.


OMG - That's so funny! :mpee:
User avatar
Black-Tulip
 
Posts: 8627
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:36 pm

Postby resigned » Thu Jul 30, 2009 5:07 pm

Black-Tulip wrote:
OMG - That's so funny! :mpee:



It's a real riot.

<object width="221" height="172"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/oaGpaibqWmg&hl=en&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/oaGpaibqWmg&hl=en&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="221" height="172"></embed></object>
Image
User avatar
resigned
 
Posts: 44946
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 9:42 pm
Location: Peru

Postby iquitos » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:32 pm

I hereby affirm and sign that if I should disappear after being gang raped on this trip that it is no one's fault but joran van der sloot cause, although he has not been charged or tried for any offense thereto related, jody bearman, art wood, tj ward, jossy mansur, jamie skeeters, dr. phil, peterick and my momma say so! wahoo aruba!
Dante described vengeance as "love of justice perverted to revenge and spite".
User avatar
iquitos
 
Posts: 21252
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: in my mind's eye

Postby resigned » Thu Jul 30, 2009 6:42 pm

iquitos wrote:I hereby affirm and sign that if I should disappear after being gang raped on this trip that it is no one's fault but joran van der sloot cause, although he has not been charged or tried for any offense thereto related, jody bearman, art wood, tj ward, jossy mansur, jamie skeeters, dr. phil, peterick and my momma say so! wahoo aruba!


...and don't forget to shake, not stir ~ "the bitch". Image
Image
User avatar
resigned
 
Posts: 44946
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 9:42 pm
Location: Peru

Postby WordsofWisdom » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:20 pm

resigned wrote:Standard group travel document.


Yeah, for parents/guardians/adults to sign, that is if you want it to carry any weight in a court of law.
Other wise it's useless.
Last edited by WordsofWisdom on Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
User avatar
WordsofWisdom
Gone to the great place in the sky
 
Posts: 12505
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:51 pm

its useless anyway if

Postby iquitos » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:25 pm

there is negligence involved. what were the chaperones there for? why did they all leave? does the waiver cover losing your kid?
Dante described vengeance as "love of justice perverted to revenge and spite".
User avatar
iquitos
 
Posts: 21252
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: in my mind's eye

Postby WordsofWisdom » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:40 pm

iquitos wrote:legally not worth the paper is is xeroxed on.


werd
"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
User avatar
WordsofWisdom
Gone to the great place in the sky
 
Posts: 12505
Joined: Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:51 pm

correction

Postby iquitos » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:42 pm

legally not worth the paper it is xeroxed on.
Dante described vengeance as "love of justice perverted to revenge and spite".
User avatar
iquitos
 
Posts: 21252
Joined: Sun Mar 26, 2006 9:46 pm
Location: in my mind's eye

Re: its useless anyway if

Postby resigned » Thu Jul 30, 2009 7:43 pm

iquitos wrote:<snip> does the waiver cover losing your kid?



That's part of the all-inclusive package. Joran and the Kalpoes sold separately.
Image
User avatar
resigned
 
Posts: 44946
Joined: Mon Aug 14, 2006 9:42 pm
Location: Peru

Postby sarge » Thu Jul 30, 2009 9:50 pm

henk wrote:Sarge, I agree it's scary to let your 18 year old daughter go.. But what could happen in Barbados what could not happen in Myrtle Beach ? And I'm not talking about difficulties being in a different country..


Henk, it was Nassau, Bahamas and it is not safe after dark.
US State Dept
Bahamas, The
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_t ... s_989.html
Travelers should avoid walking alone after dark or in isolated areas, and avoid placing themselves in situations where they are alone with strangers. Be cautious on deserted areas of beaches at all hours. Hotel guests should always lock their doors and never open their hotel room door without first verifying the identity of the person knocking. Further, hotel guests should never leave valuables unattended, especially on beaches. Visitors should store passports/identity documents, airline tickets, credit cards, and extra cash in hotel safes. Automated teller machines (ATMs) are available; however, visitors should try not to use them, especially after dark. Avoid wearing expensive jewelry, particularly expensive watches, which criminals have specifically targeted. Visitors should take care to ride only in taxis with seatbelts.

Visitors are advised to report crime to the Royal Bahamas Police Force as quickly as possible. Early reports frequently improve the likelihood of identifying and apprehending suspected perpetrators.

The U.S. Embassy has received numerous reports of sexual assaults, including assaults against teen-age girls. Most assaults have been perpetrated against intoxicated young women, some of whom had reportedly been drugged. To minimize the potential for sexual assault, the Embassy recommends that young women stay in groups, consume alcohol in moderation or not at all, ride only in licensed taxis, and not accept rides or drinks from strangers.



Myrtle Beach is lighted all night and there are people all about. It is not considered unsafe unless a person engages in risky behavior.
There is a girl, Brittanee Marie Drexel 17, missing from Myrtle Beach since April 26 of this year but she went to Myrtle Beach without her mother's permission. Her mother did not even know that she was gone from home for 4 days.
She was having depression problems because her parents were getting a divorce.
Her parents think she may still be alive and the police do too.


My point is that Aruba is not considered unsafe for graduating high school seniors and bad things can happen anywhere if good judgement is not used and especially late at night.
User avatar
sarge
 
Posts: 12737
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 8:31 am
Location: georgia

Postby petals » Sat Aug 01, 2009 10:19 am

resigned wrote:
henk wrote:Sarge, I agree it's scary to let your 18 year old daughter go.. But what could happen in Barbados what could not happen in Myrtle Beach ? And I'm not talking about difficulties being in a different country..


At least in Myrtle Beach things wouldn't be blamed on the translation problems after LE screws up the case initially because of their laissez-faire attitude. :lol:

The official language of Barbados is English so I don't think there would be any translation problems there, either.
petals
 
Posts: 837
Joined: Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:04 am

PreviousNext

Return to Natalee Holloway Case Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 1 guest